Iginio Massari: "Panettone, this is how it will be this year"

He is 76 years old, comes from Brescia and a few days ago his Pasticceria Veneto was confirmed, for the umpteenth time since 1971, as the best in Italy, according to the ranking drawn up annually by Gambero Rosso. We're talking about a Iginio Massari, the master of all pastry chefs in Italy, even if he himself specifies that the title is assigned to him out of esteem, because “mastery doesn't exist in Italy. It has existed for 140 years in Switzerland, where to obtain it you need to pass a state exam, and for 70 years in France, where there is a very selective four-year specialization course. There are years in which no one manages to obtain recognition”. Massari, on the other hand, defines himself as “a small craftsman, honored by the fact that the quality of my work is recognised. The older you get, the more you appreciate this aspect which is never taken for granted: my profession is based on skills, which are acquired in a continuous apprenticeship. Getting to the top is easy, staying there is difficult."

Massari was born in Brescia on August 29, 1942 and immediately came into contact with the world of cooking: his father was the director of a canteen and his mother was a cook. “I still remember his Bavarian mille-feuille with emotion: I have never managed, in my long career, to make one so good”. It is therefore the dessert to which the Maestro will remain sentimentally most attached, even if the one to which his name is most closely linked is undoubtedly panettone, a great specialty of the Veneto pastry shop, founded by himself 47 years ago in the center of the Lombard city. For panettone, but not only for that, Massari has been the winner of over 1964 national and international awards since 300. In March 2018 he opened his second pastry shop, in Milan, a few meters from the Duomo. A very particular place, unique in Italy, because it shares spaces (but obviously not the opening hours) with a branch of the Intesa Sanpaolo bank.

“We are proud to have brought haute patisserie to the bank for the first time opening the spaces of our branch in piazza Diaz to an exceptional partner like Iginio Massari”, explains to First&Food Mauro Federzoni, regional director of Milan and the province of Intesa Sanpaolo, adding that this is not the only initiative of this type by the bank. "The relationship with customers for a bank is fundamental and must always be enriched by identifying new ways, even unusual ones: the Massari pastry shop is an important initiative in the Milan area that follows the opening of a Puro Gusto store inside the branch of corso Vercelli, to extend the usability of the spaces to everyone according to the philosophy of sharing, the red thread of Intesa Sanpaolo's cultural and commercial projects".

Maestro Massari, how has Italian pastry changed in recent decades?

“Little in the South, which has remained tied to tradition, more in the North, where there have been some innovations. The two great revolutions for pastry making have been the advent of the refrigerator and means of communication such as TV and the Internet. The first refrigerator in Italy was sold in 1954, but it was not yet what we mean by refrigerator today: the latest generation one, which we use in the laboratory, is only from 1999. The fact of being able to keep food cold or even in the freezer for example, it has made it possible to use less sugar. The means of communication, such as television and social networks, have instead allowed more frequent exchanges of opinions, not only between producer and producer but between nations and nations, which has favored intertwining and mixing and given rise to innovations. However, not always positive and not always accompanied by dutiful experimentation, which in my opinion should always be done in the laboratory and not on the client's skin".

Are you more for tradition or innovation?

“By tradition, which, however, mind you, includes the verb 'betray'. It is therefore a matter of re-proposing a product, but of 'betraying' it in a good way, in the sense of changing it a little, over time, to improve it”.

You define yourself as a craftsman, so you are very familiar with raw materials: how have raw materials changed in all these years of your long career?

“They change all the time. Compared to when I started, eggs today are much better, they have more resistant proteins. The level of food hygiene has generally improved and trade between countries has allowed for the arrival of different fruits and vegetables, which has given rise to new flavours. Where possible, I prefer Italian raw materials, because I usually trust seriousness. But sometimes there are nasty surprises: until a few years ago, for example, kernels (apricot seeds) were used in Italy to flavor biscuits, then it was discovered that they can cause cyanide poisoning”.

How has Italian pastry evolved in its historical rivalry with the French one?

“They are similar pastry shops, which use the same raw materials. What makes the difference is the craftsmanship, which does not exist in Italy. In Italy we sometimes confuse quality with excellence, but to say that everything is excellence is not good. We are still far behind on the international market: in the largest markets, those of the USA, Japan, China, 95% of the pastry sold is French and in the remaining 5% there is also Italy but not only Italy”.

It's almost Christmas, it's time for one of his great specialties: His Majesty the Panettone.

“We produce two types of panettone: the traditional one, which we adapt every year to changing tastes, and for some years now the chocolate one with candied orange cubes. But the vast majority of our customers still ask for the traditional panettone”.

What do you mean by 'adapting it to changing tastes'?

“Insert, depending on the trend we try to interpret, more or less candied fruit, more or less raisins, more or less sugar, more or less honey and so on. For example, the yolks affect the structure: more yolk makes the panettone softer but slows down its fermentation”.

What will the 2018 panettone be like?

“There will be a strong incidence of vanilla, which is able to enhance the other aromas present. Then we added a very particular raisin, which comes from Australia. The new cooking process will make the panettone more chewable on the outside and very soft on the inside”.

In March he opened his second pastry shop, in the Intesa Sanpaolo branch in Piazza Diaz, in Milan, a stone's throw from the Duomo. What feedback have you had?

“Milan is Milan, commercially it is unbeatable. The Milanese, but also the tourists, have responded very well. I received a lot of affection, an affection that I consider sincere. It is an initiative that I would like to develop, but we need to think carefully about it because I want to maintain high quality and for this we need workers. It's not simple but the idea is to repeat the experiment”.

Apart from panettone, which dessert are you most fond of and why?

“I'm attached to panettone because it creates problems for me, and problems can create anxiety but they also give you satisfaction when you manage to solve them. On an emotional level, I still remember the Bavarian mille-feuille that my mother used to make: I've never been able to make one so good".

Is it true that you write poetry?

“Yes, even if I don't call myself a poet. Before, I wrote one every morning, dedicating it to an episode, a person, or even a cake. Now I've slowed down and stopped at 1-2 a week. I also recorded two CDs in which I collected them by having them recited by a professional actor”.

Food is now very present on TV, between talent shows and dedicated programs. You have participated in various formats, from Masterchef to The Sweetman. Do you think this overexposure promotes cooking and pastry well?

“For those with brains, even negative messages teach something, all messages have a value. What is certain is that the moving image has captured much more attention than what happened with the printed media, which in fact has somewhat marked time. There are good and less good programs but TV has given me many things, even unexpected ones. Above all, the affection of children: some of them are so passionate that they make biscuits and send them to me to let me taste them”.

Last question: can you confirm that macarons, pace the French, are very Italian?

“Of course, even the French themselves admit it. They were invented by Caterina de Medici's cook and subsequently revisited over the centuries. The latest evolution is signed by my great friend Pierre Hermé, and I am pleased that it is so because he is perhaps the only French pastry chef with a truly international attitude, and not obsessed with his Frenchness”.